ADRIAN MA, HOST:
On Friday, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's cabinet approved plans for a military takeover of Gaza City, one of the last remaining areas in the enclave not under Israeli control. The move drew condemnation internationally, as well as within Israel. Last night, tens of thousands of protesters gathered in Tel Aviv and other Israeli cities to call for an end to the war. Now, Prime Minister Netanyahu told Fox News the goal is to remove Hamas, although it's unclear whether any Palestinian political entity can fill that void after this war.
What does this mean for Gaza's future and the Palestinians who live there? To help us understand, we're joined now by Shibley Tehlahmi. He's the Anwar Sadat professor for peace and development at the University of Maryland. Shibley, thanks for taking the time.
SHIBLEY TEHLAHMI: My pleasure.
MA: So Prime Minister Netanyahu says this move into Gaza City is temporary. Is that reassuring to Palestinians, most of whom have been displaced multiple times in this war and who, according to aid organizations, are also facing starvation?
TEHLAHMI: It's hard to believe that this is temporary. It's clear that from every announcement, pronouncement that, you know, Israel has made, the aim is much bigger than that. Certainly, there are ministers in the Israeli government who want to control Gaza, settle it and displace Palestinians in what would be a, you know, war crime, ethnic cleansing. And it's hard to see how the prime minister - you know, what it means to have it or it's - that it's doable.
And think about this. The aim is, quote, "to destroy Hamas." This is something that has been said from Day 1 after the horrific attack on October 7, 2023. I wrote an article at that time for Brookings in October on - in October, 2023, saying this. The American buying into this destroying Hamas, and Biden administration specifically, was dangerous in part because, A, it's not doable. Doesn't - I don't even know what it means. And second, that it will be seen as a justification for destroying all of Gaza, which is, A, morally unacceptable and, B, a clear violation of international law.
And here we are, in the name of, you know, destroying Hamas, you know, more destruction at a time when the international community - much of the international community - says what Israel is doing is genocide, including major human rights organization, including Israeli human rights organizations. And now, according to a poll this past week, nearly half of the American voters say it's actually genocide, what's taken place in Gaza.
MA: Let me ask you - the prime minister has also said that the plan is to hand Gaza over to, quote, "Arab forces," though he didn't specify which ones. And his cabinet has also stipulated that they do not want Hamas or the Palestinian Authority, which governs the West Bank, to run Gaza. So who is poised to rebuild and run and secure the Gaza Strip?
TEHLAHMI: Well, this is a nonsensical proposition, in part because obviously, Arab states are prepared to do something, clearly. Imagine what's happening in Gaza. I mean, it's been obliterated, the infrastructure destroyed. Most people are displaced. Over 10% of the population has been either killed or wounded. And so the - what it would take even to rebuild Gaza is so extraordinary, it might even take decades to bring it back to what it was, and it was a bad place to begin with.
So Arab states - what they have said is they're prepared to play a role if this is a step toward the building of a Palestinian state, meaning they would work with the Palestinian Authority. They would help it. They might even help it militarily and economically to rebuild. But no one is going to invest any money or blood in a temporary situation where they're actually taking control. Egypt doesn't want to do so - obviously, it's the one that's supposed to play the biggest military role - but nor do the other Arab states. So it is, especially when - what - the government is saying they're precluding a role for Palestinians to govern themselves, or they're precluding a Palestinian state in the process. So it's...
MA: So...
TEHLAHMI: ...Just essentially diversion.
MA: You say that Arab states aren't keen on running Gaza. So what does this mean for the political future of Gaza if also, no acceptable Palestinian party can be created?
TEHLAHMI: Well, I think the international community - as you can see, a very significant number of states are now recognizing Palestine. Already, a majority of the states in the world recognize Palestine, but Europe is moving in that direction. Certainly France and the U.K. have declared so, and today, there was a poll showing that the German people want their government to do the same. So the idea here is obviously, if you have a plan toward a Palestinian state, that Israel is in fact held to account to implement that. Then the international community would come in and help govern Gaza, help the Palestinians build a government, help economically. You know, this is going to take tens of billions of dollars, obviously, and a long, sustained effort. So that is clearly what people are thinking. Whether it's doable or not is another question.
MA: We've been speaking with Shibley Tehlahmi, the Anwar Sadat professor for peace and development at the University of Maryland. Thanks for being here, Shibley.
TEHLAHMI: My pleasure. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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